Making Covenants

[Morley]

MG meanders some and makes some generalized statement and a whole posse comes after him in attack mode.He dodges deflects and hopes to survive and any hope of a conversation on the subject matter drowns.He is close to being the only representative of a point of view of significance to this board (an actual Mormon believer).One could wish he wouldn't get tangled up but I see little point in the gang attack.

Or he could just stop lying in all its forms, Huck. He’s been doing this shtick for over twenty years, and people are sick of his crap.

- Doc

If MG didn't speak with such self-righteous surety as he lies through his teeth--if he behaved with a little more integrity--I might agree with Huck. If MG truly represented the things the LDS Church actually teaches, I'd almost certainly agree with Huck. I used to grit my teeth and give him the benefit of the doubt, every time he posted anew. As it is, I don't believe MG acts in good faith. I've come to think that each time he posts, MG damages the Mormon religion I grew up in.

[canpakes]

.
To be fair, Pinker did publish some articles prior to his first book, but they do all sound like they concern a very specific subject focus, and appeared in uncommon publications:

Millenson, J. R., Allen, R. B. & Pinker, S. (1977). Adjunctive drinking during variable and random- interval food reinforcement schedules. Animal Learning and Behavior, 5, 285-290.

Bregman, A. S. & Pinker, S. (1978). Auditory streaming and the building of timbre. Canadian Journal of Psychology, 32, 19-31.

Pinker, S. & Kosslyn, S. M. (1978). The representation and manipulation of three-dimensional space in mental images. Journal of Mental Imagery, 1, 69-84.

Pinker, S. (1979). Formal models of language learning. Cognition, 7, 217-283. Reprinted (1994) in N. Sheehy & T. Chapman (Eds.), Cognitive Science. Cheltenham, UK: Edward Elgar Publishing. Reprinted (2013) in S. Pinker, Language, cognition, and human nature: Selected articles. New York: Oxford University Press.

Pinker, S. & Birdsong, D. (1979). Speakers’ sensitivity to rules of frozen word order. Journal of Verbal Learning and Verbal Behavior, 18, 497-508.

Kosslyn, S. M., Pinker, S., Smith, G. E., Shwartz, S. P. (1979). On the demystification of mental imagery. Behavioral and Brain Sciences, 1, 535-581. Reprinted (1981) in N. Block (Ed.), Imagery (pp. 131-150). Cambridge, MA: MIT Press, 1981.

Pinker, S. (1980). Mental imagery and the third dimension. Journal of Experimental Psychology: General, 109, 254-371.

Pinker, S. & Finke, R. A. (1980). Emergent two-dimensional patterns in images rotated in depth. Journal of Experimental Psychology: Human Perception and Performance, 6, 244-264.

Pinker, S. (1981). On the acquisition of grammatical morphemes. Journal of Child Language, 8, 477- 484.

Finke, R. A. & Pinker, S. (1982). Spontaneous mental image scanning in mental extrapolation. Journal of Experimental Psychology: Learning, Memory, and Cognition, 8, 142-147.

Finke, R. A. & Pinker, S. (1983). Directional scanning of remembered visual patterns. Journal of Experimental Psychology: Learning, Memory, and Cognition, 9, 398-410.

Rosenblum, T. & Pinker, S. (1983). Word magic revisited: Monolingual and bilingual preschoolers’ understanding of the word-object relationship. Child Development, 54, 773-780. Reprinted (1987) in M. B. Franklin & S. S. Barten (Eds.), Child language: A book of readings. New York: Oxford University Press.

Pinker, S. (1984). Visual cognition: an introduction. Cognition, 18, 1-63.

Pinker, S. Choate, P., & Finke, R. A. (1984). Mental extrapolation in patterns constructed from memory. Memory and Cognition, 12, 207-218.

Being a cultural and educational idiot, I’m not sure that I’ve heard about Pinker prior to this thread, but now, I’m interested. : D

[MG 2.0]

Man, you’ve got me going back forty five years plus or minus. My guess is that my dad, he graduated from UCLA way back when in neuroscience with a PhD., had stuff laying around and I picked it up and read it when the family moved up to Utah while I was at…or before(?)…BYU. Or I ran across stuff as I was taking my linguistics class. I really don’t know. I just remember becoming familiar with him and admiring him. It could have been in Psychology Today magazine. We subscribed to it back at some time or another.

Articles written in other magazines? I don’t know.

It’s hard to say.

Sorry to be a bit wishy washy. That was a long time ago. Longer than the age of a lot of folks on this board if I was to hazard a guess.

But I’m still standing!

Regards,
MG

Wanna know how I know MG never read anything from Pinker?

Dishonesty is baked into Mormonism.


- Doc

You may believe that as a general assessment. But to then make application of that general assessment to each and every interaction you have with someone that belongs to that faith is unreasonable and even childish in some respects.

As an adult I would think you would be able to differentiate between what you might feel/believe about an institution and members as unique individuals within that institution. You have a predisposition to find continued fault where none is warranted.

Of course, I can’t stop you, Marcus, IHAQ, Morley, or anyone else from making all encompassing judgements, but I can be honest and upright in my own mind and then hope that those that are not predisposed to over judging are able to read through the ‘flak’ that is put out there.

I’ve been transparent and honest.

Earlier I mentioned that I am under covenant with God to be honest in my dealings with my fellow man. I try my very best to do so. Others that are not under covenant with God to be honest and as truthful as possible may or my not always tell the truth or be as honest as they could be. I’m not pointing any fingers here. I’m just stating a fact. You can bank on me trying to be at my best in being as truthful and honest as is within my ability.

Memory may play into it unfortunately.

Can each of you certify and honestly say and then do the same? If so, awesome.

I would like to think that I am dealing with honest and upright people. But honestly, as I look at all the crap and crappy people inhabiting this planet along with those that are trying to live right and do right, one can’t always be sure just WHO you’re talking to on a message board.

But one can hope…

What is baked into YOU?

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

If MG truly represented the things the LDS Church actually teaches, I'd almost certainly agree with Huck.

What would possibly overcome your prejudices is if we were actually neighbors in real life. But alas, that is not to be. As it is, you are able to construct a caricature of a person that I’m not.

And the thing is, as I alluded to in my last post, I have absolutely NO IDEA of who you are as a person. Are you strictly honest? Are you above reproach? Are you of strong moral character and correct behavior with you loved ones and those you deal with each day? I have absolutely NO IDEA.

I would like to hope you are a decent, honest human being in all aspects of your life. But how would I even know? I know actually NOTHING about you except that you are a name on this board that for some reason(s) or another has strong opinions against either the church and its leaders and/or its members. Beyond that, you could be an A.I. bot.

Dang, I wish we were neighbors and I could observe whether or not you’re decent and upright or if you’re a pretender.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

I don't believe MG acts in good faith.

I do, to the the best of my ability.

Do you? And how would I know since you reveal so little of who you really are?

All I really know is that you and other critics tend to act together as a ‘hive’ of sorts now and then and seem to act with one voice. Interconnected.

Reminds me of the Borg.

Regards,
MG

[MG 2.0]

Being a cultural and educational idiot, I’m not sure that I’ve heard about Pinker prior to this thread, but now, I’m interested. : D

I listened to this earlier today. This is when I realized I’d gotten my long term memory wires crossed. It’s a good listen. He’s got a sense of humor.

https://www.ted.com/talks/steven_pinker ... anguage=en

Regards,
MG

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I see MG is just going to double down with BS instead of apologizing for implying he read the blank state along with the other books he supposedly read, and instead of claiming he read Pinker in college, and instead of reading his father’s Pinker material that was “lying around”.

Lying. Obfuscating. More lying.

When the truth offends, we lie and lie until we can no longer remember it is even there, but it is, still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth.

Dishonesty is so baked into Mormonism they’ll cling to it as if it were a limb at risk of being ripped off by a vicious animal.

- Doc

[MG 2.0]

I see MG is just going to double down with B.S. instead of apologizing for implying he read the blank state along with the other books he supposedly read, and instead of claiming he read Pinker in college, and instead of reading his father’s Pinker material that was “lying around”.

Lying. Obfuscating. More lying.

When the truth offends, we lie and lie until we can no longer remember it is even there, but it is, still there. Every lie we tell incurs a debt to the truth.

Dishonesty is so baked into Mormonism they’ll cling to it as if it were a limb at risk of being ripped off by a vicious animal.

- Doc

Think what you will.

By the way, what’s baked into YOU? What kind of person ARE you? You come across as a rather mean grumpy old man.

Regards,
MG

[Marcus]

... As it is, I don't believe MG acts in good faith...

agreed.

...I've come to think that each time he posts, MG damages the Mormon religion I grew up in.

and absolutely agreed.

[Doctor CamNC4Me]

I see MG is just going to double down with B.S. instead of apologizing for implying he read the blank state along with the other books he supposedly read, and instead of claiming he read Pinker in college, and instead of reading his father’s Pinker material that was “lying around”.

Lying. Obfuscating. More lying.



Dishonesty is so baked into Mormonism they’ll cling to it as if it were a limb at risk of being ripped off by a vicious animal.

- Doc

Think what you will.

By the way, what’s baked into YOU? What kind of person ARE you? You come across as a rather mean grumpy old man.

Regards,
MG

Well, Mormons protect Mormons who “F” kids, believe in a woman called Egyptus who discovered Egypt, and can’t seem to stop damned lying about the most mundane crap instead of just owning it, apologizing for it, and stopping the lying. Tends to make a dude grumpy when he sees someone lying his ass off for twenty years and then acting like he’s enlightened. Absurd.

- Doc