Mormon at ages 11, 15, 24 is really Joseph Smith Jr., in disguise!

[Shulem]

In your model, could the “place of Mormon” itself represent the Smith family farm? If Joseph “is” Mormon, and there is a place called Mormon, waters of Mormon, and a forest of Mormon, couldn’t Joseph be writing about his surroundings? The Smith farm had woods and water running through the property.

No, the Smith family farm has no representation in the land of Nephi wherein the land of Mormon was located, just north of Shilom and Shemlon in the tail of Delmarva which was surrounded by water. Cumorah and the surrounding areas is the Smith family farm -- near large bodies of water which are the Great Lakes.

Now, when considering Lucy's statement about how her young son told stories it seems quite reasonable that he also included names (personal pronouns) in telling those fantastic stories. Every story has characters and characters have names!

• "he would describe the ancient inhabitants of this continent" (People have names!)

Lucy,

In the four years Joseph prepared to receive the gold plates from the hill Cumorah, how much detail did your boy actually provide in describing the ancient inhabitants of this continent, in particular the western tribes of Indians? You stated in your autobiography that Joseph even described "their dress," presumably the dark skinned Lamanites. Can you elaborate on that? Do you think what he described as a youth was pretty much what he described later when translating the plates? Do you recall any names Joseph gave to any of the characters or heroes in his stories? Did he ever mention the name Mormon?

• "animals upon which they rode" (Animals have names too!)

Oh, you must be referring to the horses which we read all about in the Book of Mormon. Did Joseph tell how the ancient inhabitants rode real horses the same as people do today? Did he ever tell a story about a strong man by the name of Ammon who loved to ride horses and was an expert with a slingshot?

• "their cities" (Cities have names!)

Lucy, please think hard, do you recall Joseph naming any of the cities in which he described? You also stated that he described things "with every particular", so surely he must have given the name of at least one of those cities. Can you recall a name, please? Did he mention the cities of Zarahemla or Bountiful?

from another thread:

Not related but: In my quest to source Book of Mormon names I was reminded that many of the proper names found in the Book of Mormon were cribbed from the Bible and/or apocryphal.. Such names as Nephi, Ether, Enos, Esrom, Gad, Helem, Helam, Heth, Kish, Laban, Lemuel, Nimrah, Nimrod, to name just a few.

Recall how Smith's official history states that "Moroni" announced himself by name when telling him about the gold plates that were buried not far from his home. Thus, Smith admits to knowing the name Moroni when just 17 years old. He had four years to prepare before having to dictate a single word to his scribes while his face was buried in a hat and the plates were wrapped up in cloth. Joseph Smith was loaded for bear and ready to tell stories that were already in his mind. He was well prepared! And you won't get that from apologists and ignorant faithful do-gooders who claim nobody could have produced the Book of Mormon on such short notice.

Now, Smith claimed that Moroni spent quite a bit of time with him on that first night when appearing to him. He cited scripture, prophesied about Joseph's mission, and related matters of the gold plates and the ancient inhabitants. Surely Moroni told Joseph about his son Mormon who gave him the plates prior to being killed in battle! Surely Moroni told about how Mormon died in a war near the hill in which the plates were buried!

And there you have it! The bomb.

[Rivendale]

In your model, could the “place of Mormon” itself represent the Smith family farm? If Joseph “is” Mormon, and there is a place called Mormon, waters of Mormon, and a forest of Mormon, couldn’t Joseph be writing about his surroundings? The Smith farm had woods and water running through the property.

No, the Smith family farm has no representation in the land of Nephi wherein the land of Mormon was located, just north of Shilom and Shemlon in the tail of Delmarva which was surrounded by water. Cumorah and the surrounding areas is the Smith family farm -- near large bodies of water which are the Great Lakes.

Now, when considering Lucy's statement about how her young son told stories it seems quite reasonable that he also included names (personal pronouns) in telling those fantastic stories. Every story has characters and characters have names!

• "he would describe the ancient inhabitants of this continent" (People have names!)

Lucy,

In the four years Joseph prepared to receive the gold plates from the hill Cumorah, how much detail did your boy actually provide in describing the ancient inhabitants of this continent, in particular the western tribes of Indians? You stated in your autobiography that Joseph even described "their dress," presumably the dark skinned Lamanites. Can you elaborate on that? Do you think what he described as a youth was pretty much what he described later when translating the plates? Do you recall any names Joseph gave to any of the characters or heroes in his stories? Did he ever mention the name Mormon?

• "animals upon which they rode" (Animals have names too!)

Oh, you must be referring to the horses which we read all about in the Book of Mormon. Did Joseph tell how the ancient inhabitants rode real horses the same as people do today? Did he ever tell a story about a strong man by the name of Ammon who loved to ride horses and was an expert with a slingshot?

• "their cities" (Cities have names!)

Lucy, please think hard, do you recall Joseph naming any of the cities in which he described? You also stated that he described things "with every particular", so surely he must have given the name of at least one of those cities. Can you recall a name, please? Did he mention the cities of Zarahemla or Bountiful?

from another thread:

Not related but: In my quest to source Book of Mormon names I was reminded that many of the proper names found in the Book of Mormon were cribbed from the Bible and/or apocryphal.. Such names as Nephi, Ether, Enos, Esrom, Gad, Helem, Helam, Heth, Kish, Laban, Lemuel, Nimrah, Nimrod, to name just a few.

Recall how Smith's official history states that "Moroni" announced himself by name when telling him about the gold plates that were buried not far from his home. Thus, Smith admits to knowing the name Moroni when just 17 years old. He had four years to prepare before having to dictate a single word to his scribes while his face was buried in a hat and the plates were wrapped up in cloth. Joseph Smith was loaded for bear and ready to tell stories that were already in his mind. He was well prepared! And you won't get that from apologists and ignorant faithful do-gooders who claim nobody could have produced the Book of Mormon on such short notice.

Now, Smith claimed that Moroni spent quite a bit of time with him on that first night when appearing to him. He cited scripture, prophesied about Joseph's mission, and related matters of the gold plates and the ancient inhabitants. Surely Moroni told Joseph about his son Mormon who gave him the plates prior to being killed in battle! Surely Moroni told about how Mormon died in a war near the hill in which the plates were buried!

And there you have it! The bomb.

I always wondered why these reanimated native Americans and the two gods had conversations with Joseph sometimes in tremendous detail and yet when it was time to produce the Book of Mormon they simply did not have the time to tell Joseph what to write but instead opted for parlor trick antics and occultic magic. They had to know this would introduce Joseph's selective wordings including local vernacular including rustic yokel slang.